ciedan(1846) vs. hurtedking(1855) *
Login to get PGN standard 45+45, 2015-10-31
1.d4 (0:00) d5 (0:00) 2.Nc3 (0:03)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: so. 2...Bf5 (0:47)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: Verosov attack ideas in the position, right?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: Veresov, which one it might be, don't know. 3.Bg5 (0:25) c6 (1:36) 4.e3 (2:26)
ciedan(1846) whispers: lets go with the easy development, so Bd3 may follow 4...Nd7 (2:44) 5.Bd3 (0:06) Bxd3 (0:04) 6.Qxd3 (0:04) Ngf6 (0:33) 7.Nf3 (1:28) e6 (0:20) 8.e4 (1:15) dxe4 (0:16) 9.Nxe4 (0:04) Be7 (0:02) 10.Bxf6 (0:19) Nxf6 (0:16)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: looks like reasonable game by both
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it does look like black didn't equalize fully
herrahuu(1737) whispers: c4, say
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it is carokann structure!
herrahuu(1737) whispers: c5 is the center of black focus i'd say 11.O-O-O (5:17) Qa5 (0:51)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: now queen is before the pawns
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this looks dubious to me 12.Kb1 (0:53) O-O-O (0:25)
Ismirdochegal(2233) whispers: Your own play earlier today was very dubious, too ;)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: so you're saying i should not deem something else dubious?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: or saw it as somekind of personal attack against HurtedKing?
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: nah, was just making a cheeky remark
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ok.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: yeah. agreed totally..
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i really should learn more.
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: we all should
herrahuu(1737) whispers: but. there you go. i got this limited mental capacity and try to make best of it :)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: what just happened? 13.Ne5 (3:30)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: catles long?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i never saw this in million years :D
herrahuu(1737) whispers: as in could've imagined
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: its rather safe, when whites king is also there 13...Rhf8 (0:37)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ok.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this does not ring right to me.
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: it used to be an age old caro kann rule to always castle to the same side as white did
herrahuu(1737) whispers: interesting that now queenside play is the attacking play and play on kingside would be positional?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: aha. :)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: thanks for all the comments btw
herrahuu(1737) whispers: greatly appreciated
ciedan(1846) whispers: should i go for Nxf6 gfNc4 Qsome or maybe Nxf6 Bxf6 Qxh7 Bxd5 de5 Qxd5 Qxg7?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i am very kingside castling oriented as caro player. but of course i don't know a lot...
herrahuu(1737) whispers: and of course you cannot be fixated on such an idea as - this side i will castle
KayVee(1600) whispers: gooo ciedan
herrahuu(1737) whispers: that looks like piece play oriented approach.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: maybe you could kill black positionally?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it looks like you have much better position?
ciedan(1846) whispers: wait the queen is on d5 so my last imagined move would lose my Q lol
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: blacks position looks safe and sound enough
herrahuu(1737) whispers: "in good position improve the position"
herrahuu(1737) whispers: of course there isn't anything i like more than HurtedKing give proper treatment to white so that he doesn't find the closes kebab kiosk after the game but...
herrahuu(1737) whispers: just objectively i prefer white
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i don't know if it's objective though.... hmmm
herrahuu(1737) whispers: instinctively, maybe?
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: this kebab thing is just weird
KayVee(1600) whispers: kebab?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it is reference to old classic finnish hockey commentary reference. kebab. i wonder what's that actually in english. 14.Nxf6 (7:32)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: some traditional turkish food?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i think.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this might be wrong.
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: yeah, thats it
KayVee(1600) whispers: I know what a kebab is - just didnt think it was popular in finland
herrahuu(1737) whispers: you had quite a bit of space 14...Bxf6 (0:31)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: so exchanges should help black?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i mean - advantage in space
herrahuu(1737) whispers: if there is some tactic that gives you other kind of advantage, that's just good
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i mean, you don't have to hold unto the quality of advantage at all 15.Nc4 (1:31)
Ismirdochegal(2235) whispers: it is just that white does not have an advantage here
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ok :)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: so i wonder why i look at it so pessimistically
herrahuu(1737) whispers: yeah this looks much more equalish
Ismirdochegal(2235) whispers: consider Qd5 now
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i was rather talking the position before Nxf6
herrahuu(1737) whispers: Qd6 looks quite natural
herrahuu(1737) whispers: h7 is protected by the time being by the fact that c4 knight is hanging
herrahuu(1737) whispers: d5, sry
KayVee(1600) whispers: Qd5 double attacks d4 g7 -
herrahuu(1737) whispers: Qg2, if you meant this looks very greedy
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it looks like natural idea though.
KayVee(1600) whispers: g2 - yes - just very dyslexic today
herrahuu(1737) whispers: queen should reach most squares from the middle
herrahuu(1737) whispers: board sometimes flips this way, i am very used to this
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ...
zitterbart(1917) whispers: well the bishop protects g7, so the immediate counterplay should be limited
herrahuu(1737) whispers: aha
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i missed this
herrahuu(1737) whispers: just thought Qxg2 Rhg1 or Rfg1 it is quite messy
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i am still very unhappy about Nxf6 from white perspective 15...Qb5 (9:00)
zitterbart(1917) whispers: if Na3 QxQ probably 16.b3 (1:39)
zitterbart(1917) whispers: there still is Qd5 or Qg5
zitterbart(1917) whispers: this looks reasonable for the perspective of grabiing the h7 pawn without unprotecting the knight
zitterbart(1917) whispers: but a little weak on the black squares
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: isnt rxd4 threatened..with rxc4 to follow?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: aha.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: yes!
herrahuu(1737) whispers: nice one
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: what kind of trick might wh try tho...
zitterbart(1917) whispers: does QxR not work?
KayVee(1600) whispers: Rxd4 Nd6+
Ismirdochegal(2237) whispers: bxd4 is safe though
KayVee(1600) whispers: but White is weak on the dark squares - gotta watch out
ciedan(1846) whispers: the position looks so promising for black, but luckily I have one or two tricks in the hand so, it may only be slightly worse position, my guess is -0,6
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: ahh, nd6+ is good trick
zitterbart(1917) whispers: ah you mean after Qxh7
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: not sure wh even lusts for qxh7 :P
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ciedan, i think it is somehow human to overextend impressions
herrahuu(1737) whispers: probably it is closer to equal than that
mcstorytaller(1807) whispers: hi zitterbart
herrahuu(1737) whispers: black seems to have some pull though
herrahuu(1737) whispers: maybe =/+
zitterbart(1917) whispers: not sure either, but i think after Rxc4 Qxc4 may work
zitterbart(1917) whispers: if the queen is still available 16...h6 (9:33)
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: qe2 prevents the rxc4
mcstorytaller(1807) whispers: 2 of my friends was chat about your beard
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this move is very sad move to make
mcstorytaller(1807) whispers: one think its bs, other that it's a gift
herrahuu(1737) whispers: now you need e5 f5 g5 to make some progress
zitterbart(1917) whispers: Nd6+ is good point though
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: non sequitur :P
zitterbart(1917) whispers: fork on the queen, rook has to take
Ismirdochegal(2237) whispers: bxd4 was fine, im sure 17.c3 (2:39)
zitterbart(1917) whispers: lol obviously they cannot know about the awesomeness of my beard
Ismirdochegal(2239) whispers: I guess they have quite some phantasy
KayVee(1600) whispers: were better moves than h6 for sure... now White has clear advantage imo
herrahuu(1737) whispers: kayvee, wow.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: that must have been some lousy move then.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: but it is true. you cannot play this position passively
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it reminds me of this exchange frenches and carokanns
herrahuu(1737) whispers: the nature of position is such that the tides turn easily without big mistake dramatically
KayVee(1600) whispers: viewed with the lens of a 1600 that still plays like 1400 sometimes <------ yes
herrahuu(1737) whispers: requires very careful handling of the position
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this one
herrahuu(1737) whispers: especially with the major guns still around :) 17...Rd7 (6:22)
KayVee(1600) whispers: and of course, I'm partial to White as well :D being my teammate, haha
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: :-)
ciedan(1846) whispers: mh, i can force a exchange with Ne5 (Rd5 or Bxe5) Qxb5 Rxb5 Rhe1
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: not sure if i can say clear adv, but i will say, imho, white is at least being given a chance to try and come up with something after dodging a minor bullet :-)
ciedan(1846) whispers: looks like a decent position, and Rd5 is not posible because of c4
TwilightShifter(1822) whispers: looks pretty equal 18.Ne5 (6:42) Qxd3+ (0:08) 19.Nxd3 (0:04)
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: well certainly bodes for entertaining third act with lots of pieces N pawns all over
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this c3 d4 doesn't look whites dream come true...
zitterbart(1917) whispers: oh the queens have left the board ciedan lost connection; game adjourned *
herrahuu(1737) whispers: so. 2...Bf5 (0:47)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: Verosov attack ideas in the position, right?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: Veresov, which one it might be, don't know. 3.Bg5 (0:25) c6 (1:36) 4.e3 (2:26)
ciedan(1846) whispers: lets go with the easy development, so Bd3 may follow 4...Nd7 (2:44) 5.Bd3 (0:06) Bxd3 (0:04) 6.Qxd3 (0:04) Ngf6 (0:33) 7.Nf3 (1:28) e6 (0:20) 8.e4 (1:15) dxe4 (0:16) 9.Nxe4 (0:04) Be7 (0:02) 10.Bxf6 (0:19) Nxf6 (0:16)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: looks like reasonable game by both
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it does look like black didn't equalize fully
herrahuu(1737) whispers: c4, say
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it is carokann structure!
herrahuu(1737) whispers: c5 is the center of black focus i'd say 11.O-O-O (5:17) Qa5 (0:51)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: now queen is before the pawns
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this looks dubious to me 12.Kb1 (0:53) O-O-O (0:25)
Ismirdochegal(2233) whispers: Your own play earlier today was very dubious, too ;)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: so you're saying i should not deem something else dubious?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: or saw it as somekind of personal attack against HurtedKing?
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: nah, was just making a cheeky remark
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ok.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: yeah. agreed totally..
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i really should learn more.
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: we all should
herrahuu(1737) whispers: but. there you go. i got this limited mental capacity and try to make best of it :)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: what just happened? 13.Ne5 (3:30)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: catles long?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i never saw this in million years :D
herrahuu(1737) whispers: as in could've imagined
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: its rather safe, when whites king is also there 13...Rhf8 (0:37)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ok.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this does not ring right to me.
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: it used to be an age old caro kann rule to always castle to the same side as white did
herrahuu(1737) whispers: interesting that now queenside play is the attacking play and play on kingside would be positional?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: aha. :)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: thanks for all the comments btw
herrahuu(1737) whispers: greatly appreciated
ciedan(1846) whispers: should i go for Nxf6 gfNc4 Qsome or maybe Nxf6 Bxf6 Qxh7 Bxd5 de5 Qxd5 Qxg7?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i am very kingside castling oriented as caro player. but of course i don't know a lot...
herrahuu(1737) whispers: and of course you cannot be fixated on such an idea as - this side i will castle
KayVee(1600) whispers: gooo ciedan
herrahuu(1737) whispers: that looks like piece play oriented approach.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: maybe you could kill black positionally?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it looks like you have much better position?
ciedan(1846) whispers: wait the queen is on d5 so my last imagined move would lose my Q lol
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: blacks position looks safe and sound enough
herrahuu(1737) whispers: "in good position improve the position"
herrahuu(1737) whispers: of course there isn't anything i like more than HurtedKing give proper treatment to white so that he doesn't find the closes kebab kiosk after the game but...
herrahuu(1737) whispers: just objectively i prefer white
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i don't know if it's objective though.... hmmm
herrahuu(1737) whispers: instinctively, maybe?
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: this kebab thing is just weird
KayVee(1600) whispers: kebab?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it is reference to old classic finnish hockey commentary reference. kebab. i wonder what's that actually in english. 14.Nxf6 (7:32)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: some traditional turkish food?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i think.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this might be wrong.
Ismirdochegal(2234) whispers: yeah, thats it
KayVee(1600) whispers: I know what a kebab is - just didnt think it was popular in finland
herrahuu(1737) whispers: you had quite a bit of space 14...Bxf6 (0:31)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: so exchanges should help black?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i mean - advantage in space
herrahuu(1737) whispers: if there is some tactic that gives you other kind of advantage, that's just good
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i mean, you don't have to hold unto the quality of advantage at all 15.Nc4 (1:31)
Ismirdochegal(2235) whispers: it is just that white does not have an advantage here
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ok :)
herrahuu(1737) whispers: so i wonder why i look at it so pessimistically
herrahuu(1737) whispers: yeah this looks much more equalish
Ismirdochegal(2235) whispers: consider Qd5 now
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i was rather talking the position before Nxf6
herrahuu(1737) whispers: Qd6 looks quite natural
herrahuu(1737) whispers: h7 is protected by the time being by the fact that c4 knight is hanging
herrahuu(1737) whispers: d5, sry
KayVee(1600) whispers: Qd5 double attacks d4 g7 -
herrahuu(1737) whispers: Qg2, if you meant this looks very greedy
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it looks like natural idea though.
KayVee(1600) whispers: g2 - yes - just very dyslexic today
herrahuu(1737) whispers: queen should reach most squares from the middle
herrahuu(1737) whispers: board sometimes flips this way, i am very used to this
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ...
zitterbart(1917) whispers: well the bishop protects g7, so the immediate counterplay should be limited
herrahuu(1737) whispers: aha
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i missed this
herrahuu(1737) whispers: just thought Qxg2 Rhg1 or Rfg1 it is quite messy
herrahuu(1737) whispers: i am still very unhappy about Nxf6 from white perspective 15...Qb5 (9:00)
zitterbart(1917) whispers: if Na3 QxQ probably 16.b3 (1:39)
zitterbart(1917) whispers: there still is Qd5 or Qg5
zitterbart(1917) whispers: this looks reasonable for the perspective of grabiing the h7 pawn without unprotecting the knight
zitterbart(1917) whispers: but a little weak on the black squares
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: isnt rxd4 threatened..with rxc4 to follow?
herrahuu(1737) whispers: aha.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: yes!
herrahuu(1737) whispers: nice one
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: what kind of trick might wh try tho...
zitterbart(1917) whispers: does QxR not work?
KayVee(1600) whispers: Rxd4 Nd6+
Ismirdochegal(2237) whispers: bxd4 is safe though
KayVee(1600) whispers: but White is weak on the dark squares - gotta watch out
ciedan(1846) whispers: the position looks so promising for black, but luckily I have one or two tricks in the hand so, it may only be slightly worse position, my guess is -0,6
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: ahh, nd6+ is good trick
zitterbart(1917) whispers: ah you mean after Qxh7
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: not sure wh even lusts for qxh7 :P
herrahuu(1737) whispers: ciedan, i think it is somehow human to overextend impressions
herrahuu(1737) whispers: probably it is closer to equal than that
mcstorytaller(1807) whispers: hi zitterbart
herrahuu(1737) whispers: black seems to have some pull though
herrahuu(1737) whispers: maybe =/+
zitterbart(1917) whispers: not sure either, but i think after Rxc4 Qxc4 may work
zitterbart(1917) whispers: if the queen is still available 16...h6 (9:33)
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: qe2 prevents the rxc4
mcstorytaller(1807) whispers: 2 of my friends was chat about your beard
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this move is very sad move to make
mcstorytaller(1807) whispers: one think its bs, other that it's a gift
herrahuu(1737) whispers: now you need e5 f5 g5 to make some progress
zitterbart(1917) whispers: Nd6+ is good point though
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: non sequitur :P
zitterbart(1917) whispers: fork on the queen, rook has to take
Ismirdochegal(2237) whispers: bxd4 was fine, im sure 17.c3 (2:39)
zitterbart(1917) whispers: lol obviously they cannot know about the awesomeness of my beard
Ismirdochegal(2239) whispers: I guess they have quite some phantasy
KayVee(1600) whispers: were better moves than h6 for sure... now White has clear advantage imo
herrahuu(1737) whispers: kayvee, wow.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: that must have been some lousy move then.
herrahuu(1737) whispers: but it is true. you cannot play this position passively
herrahuu(1737) whispers: it reminds me of this exchange frenches and carokanns
herrahuu(1737) whispers: the nature of position is such that the tides turn easily without big mistake dramatically
KayVee(1600) whispers: viewed with the lens of a 1600 that still plays like 1400 sometimes <------ yes
herrahuu(1737) whispers: requires very careful handling of the position
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this one
herrahuu(1737) whispers: especially with the major guns still around :) 17...Rd7 (6:22)
KayVee(1600) whispers: and of course, I'm partial to White as well :D being my teammate, haha
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: :-)
ciedan(1846) whispers: mh, i can force a exchange with Ne5 (Rd5 or Bxe5) Qxb5 Rxb5 Rhe1
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: not sure if i can say clear adv, but i will say, imho, white is at least being given a chance to try and come up with something after dodging a minor bullet :-)
ciedan(1846) whispers: looks like a decent position, and Rd5 is not posible because of c4
TwilightShifter(1822) whispers: looks pretty equal 18.Ne5 (6:42) Qxd3+ (0:08) 19.Nxd3 (0:04)
shivaroxxx(1720) whispers: well certainly bodes for entertaining third act with lots of pieces N pawns all over
herrahuu(1737) whispers: this c3 d4 doesn't look whites dream come true...
zitterbart(1917) whispers: oh the queens have left the board ciedan lost connection; game adjourned *
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